51

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

BTW, here one of my favourite channels in regard to compounds (slightly off-topic here, too).
Like in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9ObkuYRc54, where he's speaking a simple truth that holds for archery in general (at the 5:00 mark).
"Do you need a <add flagship bow of favourite company here> to shoot better ? No, you don't. You need to practice."

52

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

Haha.  When I read this line I wasn't quite sure where you were going at first but then I read on....

I've been seen as freak by many others most of my life. But I don't care anymore...

I'll pop in every now and again and see what Armin has to say. ...

Not because of reservations about Armin. But at the moment, I have more than enough bows of that kind.
And if I consider a new one, I will definitely try it before I buy.

53

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

Not much to add for me.

He reviews alot of guitars that are no where near the level ...

The guy is a freak.
That's what you are called today if you stand by your own opinion, even if it hurts. The channel would perhaps be one of my favourites if I was into music ...

I will say that a company with the  consumer reach, and manufacturing capabilities (tons and tons of bows and arrows manufactured in a relatively short amount of time) such as AliBow would more than likely be easily able to make such offers.

It wouldn't matter to me from which manufacturer the "reviewer" accepts a pre-payment. All reviews would be tainted in my eyes.
BTW, didn't visit the discussed channel for about two month now.
And I passed a chance to buy a used Alibow bow last week.

54

(3 replies, posted in Arrows)

Interesting shapes.
Does anyone have information about average weights of the depicted arrowheads ?

55

(6 replies, posted in Bows)

Jawa wrote:

Although I’m not too excited about sanding all this fiberglass. I’m going to need a way to control the dust.

Wetting the sandpaper ?
The stuff sold here (at least that with fabric backing) can be used dry and wet, this is explicitly noted on the backside.

Jawa wrote:

I haven’t got the wood for the siyahs yet.  Maybe I’m underestimating the complexity, but it seems relatively easy to carve?

Wood is an anisotropic material. When trying to carve it from a single piece, the fibers need to go along with the shape, or it will break immediately.
Or you can use the plywood approach - 3 or 4 thin layers, with the fibers crosswise. I actually have a bow with siyahs made this way. Perhaps you can replace one layer with glassfiber.

56

(6 replies, posted in Bows)

This forum seems less of a DIY bowyer meeting area, for what reasons soever.
But it would be great if you keep us (me) updated about the proceeding of your projects.

As mentioned, there are several resources on the net, like bowyer fora and YT videos.
IMHO a bow with siyahs is already an advanced project - I don't have any personal experience with that.

57

(6 replies, posted in Bows)

I reckon that fiberglass bows, as Alibow's tiny one, are plain fiberglass limbs wrapped with leather. Nothing laminated.
I don't have much experience as bowyer on my own, but there are (other) archery fora which cover such topics extensively, even horn/sinew composites. And last but not least, you might find hints on YT.

I started a somehow similar project month ago, for a special club event that never materialized. It is a more Manchu-sized bow, with plain split bamboo as limbs. Perhaps going to finish it someday...

58

(18 replies, posted in Bows)

Did a short side-by-side comparison of both bows this weekend ("Nomad" and "Forever Carbon").
The Nomad is much easier to draw, only noticeable building up at the last few inches. The White Feathers bow is harder to draw from the beginning.
And as said, both have a nominally identical draw weight.
I didn't see difference in arrow flight, though (400gn cedar wood, 32"). Shooting three arrows with each bow on our 60 yard target, I got three hits for the Nomad and two for the White Feathers.
Shooting instinctively, this is not really hard evidence.
But I definitely like the Nomad more, and I'm better with it.

59

(18 replies, posted in Bows)

Because of a 30 per cent discount in my favourite shop, I bought a 35# Nomad KTB recently.
Technical details are similar to a Carbon Forever bow from White Feathers, so a direct comparision seems in order.
Only the Nomad is 48", the Carbon Forever 53" (henceforth called CF). I choose the 53" variant of the latter, which is also available in 48".

Both are from Freddie Archery, and look very similar. Limbs are covered with an identical fabric. The CF has a smaller grip, wrapped with what looks like thin leather. The Nomad grip is bigger, and covered with a straw-colored pimpled rubber. It looks ugly, but feels more comfortable, and gives me better control then the CF grip.
The rest is again quite similar. The Nomad looks a bit more elaborate, yet mostly plastic details.
Performance-wise, there is not much difference. I got the impression the CF has slightly more punch, doing better with the heavy wood arrows I use. I didn't shoot them back-to-back, though.
If I find the time, I do a speed and distance measurment over the turn of the year.

In conclusion, very similar bows with very similar characteristics. The Nomad used to be about 20 per cent more expensive here. It seems you only pay that 20% for looks, not performance.

60

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

No.
I only have an "enforced"Google/YT  login, once created for an Android device, and and named after it (the device). I very rarely do login or comment to any YT site.
I've seen my comment then for an hour or so.

What that implies IMHO - we might not see all comments criticizing reviewed bows ...

61

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

Recently found out the person running the YT channel discussed her mostly doesn't like criticism too much.
On occasion of a "zombie" video filmed on the outdoor range, I commented that my bow would easily reach the neighbouring residences behind the targets. Censorship was swift ...

It says "may not ship to Austria", usually a sign for significant shipping costs.
Because one of my favourite shops recently dropped their prices for Freddie's bows by about 30%, I rather got a new nomad ktb. And while it's grip looks ugly, it feels and hold really nice.

The story is relatively the same.

Yes. Not really impressive in comparison, but not bad either.
If there was a distributor here in Europe, I would perhaps consider getting one for training. But shipping costs from Asia tend to destroy price advantages.

I assume "Bow rating" means the specification of the manufacturer (paper value), and "Actual Draw" means your actual measurement.
That makes me wonder if said bow is anywhere near the spec. values at 28" - I guess not.
Perhaps the spec. really means "at 31" and not 28", which would make sense for that type of bow.

Or it has already lost some pounds, as reported from similar Rolan bows.

Interesting/strange bow data:

Bow Rating: 30#@28"
Actual Draw: 31#@32.5"

If the draw weight at 28" is correct, that would mean a tiny 1# increase of draw weight per 3 inches. Most bows I know have about 3..4# per inch for that range.
But I assume the 30#@28" are not correct.

66

(3 replies, posted in Bows)

I guess the bow was already damaged, causing it to twist during draw.
I have a bow where the string jumps off the string bridges when shot at warm summer temperatures, probably because of some improper gluing. Not a Kaya (or Korean style bow), though.
And I have a 40# Kaya where the limbs bend unevenly, because of a longitudinal crack in a limb. I don't shoot that bow anymore.

67

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

Just to be explicit, I do not think there is money flowing for this reviews in the background.

Trying to think in the shoes of both sides:
As a bowyer, I would double or triple-check a bow before sending him to a independant reviewer. A (more or less) open platform like YT reaches hundreds or thousands of potential customers, so mistakes quickly damage your reputation.
And as a reviewer, you are tempted to be nice, or else the bowyer might drop you for his next bows. So don't dig too deep, and don't be too meticulous.

More than a decade ago, I had subscibed to a computer magazine that did quite comprehensive reviews. They bought the stuff anonymous, and called things as they are. As one might guess, they were not really loved accross that industry. But all watered down through the years, and they are doing the ubiquitous "Word and Excel tricks" now.

I brought compounds up, as an obvious and extreme example. Many distributors/shops who do YT reviews have written contracts with manufacturers. And as I heard, some (compound bow) manufacturers even forbid dealers to put certain other brands in their shop. A healthy competition, it seems ...

68

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

I understood it correct, then.
But mentioned conflict of interests seems to loom there in the background, for sure. I won't indulge in assumptions.

As a side note, I tried Compound shooting recently. I've checked many YT bow reviews, and >95% of them are more or less blatant sales pushes. With prices in the 400 ... 1.500 USD range and dealer/distributor networks, the temptation seems much bigger.

69

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

He even notes that he was invited to shoot with the owner's niece in China towards the end ...

I remember that, but listened "with a half ear", as we use to say here. Not sure if he spoke about the past or the future.
Anyway, I had been thinking about such a bow (or similar long draw) as well, but deferred it indefinitely. Also because of the comments here. I have a local alternative (Vegh distributor), were I have the option of try-before-buy. Even if it's a bit more expensive.
My lightweight glassfiber bows from Alibow still hold up quite well, though.

As said, the foam limbs are quite common in the olympic world, especially ILF limbs. Some fellow archers in my club shooting them - on metal risers.
That's another thing that looks interesting, but some while ago I realized I had spread myself too thin, trying too much bows and arrows. Which is not very helpful for form and precision, I think.

70

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

Now this is quite enthusiastic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGzF8OF_xe0 IMHO overly so.
Banging and hand-shock is not a good sign. This means energy is remaining in the bow, and not passed on to the arrow.
Giving a minimal gpp recommendation (like cinnabar) would be wise for the manufacturer, I think.

And I would be interested in the long-term durability of mentioned foam inlays.
This technology is quite common for the mid- and upper price range of olympic bows. But as I know, foam limbs use to hold up about one year of normal intensity training of an active (professional) archer. Then, they need replacement.

71

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

Yes, I think it's becoming better.
However, I still miss a test on distances greater than 10 meters, and a kind of long-term test.
The first one would be easy, as he has videos from his outdoor range. And good mediterranean archers do blank shaft test at least at 10m and 20m, because it usually takes 20 to 30m for the arrow oscillations to settle.

But perhaps I'm too harsh, because testing is an important part of my day job. And a good tester tries to "break" the product without exceeding it's limits.

72

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

Not really surprised about the probable Scythian draw weights. They wanted similar effects on animals and armour, so required similar draw weights.

Though not always did mounted archers prefer to use thumb draw.  Apparently, Huns, Mongols, and even Turks would use fingered releases to varying degrees.

This could well be. Besides the Kassai style, there are other finger draw styles suitable for horseback archery. Unfortunately it seems, archeologists are not very interested in such details.

There are tons of discussions about all this over at ATARN and totally worth it to check it out:
http://www.atarn.org/

I had been aware of the ATARN site, but not yet read all pages.
I think I continue after my holidays, which are planned to proceed (almost) without computer / electronic devices. Being a "professional keyboard warrior", I need a rest sometimes ...

73

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

Again we must ask: is the whole story really there in these videos?

To put my words cautiously - the YT channel is a very good marketing platform for the "attached" bowmakers. The products are not tested in a too tough manner...
I'm into compound shooting as well, and I noticed the same in this niche. Only with much more money involved. I quickly learned to discern sales-pitches-by-proxy from real reviews.
At the end of the day, it depends on the "due diligence" of the potential customer.

The guys over at ATARN have done alot of research  apparently in this matter and they pretty much say the hypothesis that Scythians used a thumbring or draw should be put to rest.

I approached this issue from a mainly "energetical" view. Being famous as good archers, their arrows supposedly had a proper "punch", even against armour equivalent to medieval periods. This implies draw weights comparable to the Manchus and English, assuming similar stature and performance.
Deducing the approximate draw curve from preserved bow fragments (as done with other bows), it should be possible to conclude if it was used with a mediterranean style (26..28") of thumb draw (30"..34"), ignoring the short ottoman draw here for a moment.
Kinetic energy is proportional to draw length (actually, draw length minus brace height), which enabled me to shoot 400gn arrows with competitive performance on a "weak" 25" bow. And draw length beyond the chin would IMHO suppose thumb draw, at least in mounted archery.
The English used a 30..31" finger draw in war, but only for unprecise "arrow hails" and clout shooting.
Just my 2 cents...

74

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

Most important thing to know about Scythian technique: no evidence of thumbring usage exists among them.

They could have used leather, which works fine for me. Or do it "Armin Hirmer style" - with bare thumb. I used to shoot my weak (25")  Alibow Qinghai mostly without protection.
But that is speculation.  I believe the construction parameters of bow artifacts could give an indication of  the used style.

And bridging back to said bow reviews - I am recently having a problem with a bow favourably reviewed by Armin. The bow is Awar style, and well made. However, it doesn't stand heat very well. Above 20°C, it seems to lose torsional stiffness, and the string jumps off the tiny string brigdes while shooting. Shooting a bow for a few minutes in a well tempered room at 10 yard is not really a hard criterion.
Well, it will become my winter bow then ...

75

(65 replies, posted in Bows)

To stay with this topic, I watched the movie "Rise of the Scythian" (Russian: "скиф") recently. It features some archery scenes, and even e few with revealing close-ups. Which left me confused, actually. There was no consistent style. Arrows on both sides of the bow, and one close-up even revealed an Avatar-style draw (mediterranean reversed, i.e. palm outward).
Seems Russian movie directors place as much value on historical accuracy as the Hollywood counterparts ...

As a side note, the Russian term "скиф" seems coincidentially  quite similar to the Kantonese "shifu". Well, like Scythia vs. Scotia, Albion vs. Albania, and Rome vs. Romania ...