• From: Innvik, Norway
  • Registered: 2015-08-25
  • Posts: 44
  • User Karma: 1

Topic: Manchu thumb ring problems

Hi. Can anyone help on the subject of Manchu thumb rings? I bought a horn ring from China at a reasonable price and thought I'd give it a go because I read that a guy called Dekker recommended the use for Chinese types bows. Obviously it might just be the case that it was ill suited for Korean bows. Which is what I had in mind.
The ring diameter was 22 mm, too tight for me. After some expanding with sand paper it was still tight but kind of ok. Not wanting to go too wide seemed a good idea.
I studied http://mandarinmansion.com/articles/Usi … Dekker.pdf and tried to twist the thumb hand clockwise to hold on for dear life, then release turning in the other direction. Sometimes this went ok. Sometimes though the release caused the ring to fly off.
Last time this happened the ring flew into a wall (shooting inside our house) and cracked on one side. It has been glued back together but this hurdle is frustratingly high for me. I haven't a clue. Is this just practice needed or can anyone offer some insights?

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  • Registered: 2015-02-10
  • Posts: 65
  • User Karma: 10

Re: Manchu thumb ring problems

I have been curious about the Manchu and Mongolian thumb rings.  Haven't tried using one yet.  From the older photos the arrows they used were huge.  I assumed they used that style ring for its strength and ability to launch such big arrows with a heavy large bow.  So that style ring might not be ideal for the small Korean bows.  I'm not really sure.  Have you tried making a leather thumb ring?  Thats the way to go in my opinion.

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  • Registered: 2015-12-29
  • Posts: 36
  • User Karma: 4

Re: Manchu thumb ring problems

I looked at those Manchu rings but I was wondering if they  would fly off.  I think you have to keep your thumb bent on release, or at least that was my theory

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  • From: Innvik, Norway
  • Registered: 2015-08-25
  • Posts: 44
  • User Karma: 1

Re: Manchu thumb ring problems

A leather thumb ring would not do in this case, I'm afraid. The string rests on a shelf forming a 120 degree angle with the tube that is the ring. It is long enough that it can be placed over the joint, not beyond. @basilisk: My theory too, but how can I achieve this in practice? You try it. The thumb has 3 joints like the other fingers. How ever, only the top one is really mobile. Trying to keep that bent and then somehow flexing only the lower joint is tricky. Any thoughts?

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5 Reply by Pedro C (edited by Pedro C 2016-01-05 20:18:53)

  • From: SoCal
  • Registered: 2015-08-12
  • Posts: 319
  • User Karma: 15

Re: Manchu thumb ring problems

Something with the angle on the inside allowing the thumb to lock with it and materials such as deer antler being sticky? I only got it to work after lining the inside of my wooden ring (which perhaps was too short) with paper towel but it ended up ripping the skin off the sides of my thumb. Maybe Caesar Zhiyu Zhang could help - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OY2fjnCdRR0

I've given up on Manchu rings and just use a "Victory" ring. It's perfect, especially with a sueded leather "leaf" inside the ring, but the string sometimes rips off skin on the side of my index on release... got too used to a leather glove, I guess. Maybe a long leather kulak or the protection that master Heon K. Kim and some of his students use could help.

Pedro C's Website

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  • Registered: 2015-12-29
  • Posts: 36
  • User Karma: 4

Re: Manchu thumb ring problems

That was my problem as well.  I figured I need to get the regular thumbring "mastered" before moving on to something else.

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  • From: Innvik, Norway
  • Registered: 2015-08-25
  • Posts: 44
  • User Karma: 1

Re: Manchu thumb ring problems

Tonight I gave the videos of Caesar and others another look. I may have to thicken my string. Korean strings are doubled and perhaps the Manchu are as well? This just might make shooting with a cylindrical thumb ring feasible. Does anybody know?

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8 Reply by Pedro C (edited by Pedro C 2016-01-07 23:24:06)

  • From: SoCal
  • Registered: 2015-08-12
  • Posts: 319
  • User Karma: 15

Re: Manchu thumb ring problems

peterhaslund wrote:

Tonight I gave the videos of Caesar and others another look. I may have to thicken my string. Korean strings are doubled and perhaps the Manchu are as well? This just might make shooting with a cylindrical thumb ring feasible. Does anybody know?

Manchu strings are typically very thick.

https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xft1/v/t1.0-9/12219468_165864123768264_2225968668407815103_n.jpg?oh=dd6ff9f2935111e9ecffa513becd6425&oe=570C000F

You can always just apply thicker serving, as long as your arrows will allow it. Or maybe serve thick below the nock point.

But I don't think the string thickness really makes a difference.

This video was made 2 years ago. Now I am using a jade ring, and it works fine. Keep your thumb as straight as you can with your wrist rotating inward, and it will not hurt for either thick or thin strings.

Who knows how he manages it. The ring would just go flying off the thumb for me. There didn't seem to be an explanation of how the wrist rotating inward would apply forces that would keep the ring from flying off in Peter Dekker's PDF. Peter Dekker administers http://atarn.net/phpBB2 now, by the way. He may be reachable there. ... . ..

Turkish thumb ring technique might be similar in how forces are applied to the thumb/how the string goes in the edge of the ring.. might be easier. Turkish thumb rings are pretty small too.

Pedro C's Website

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  • From: Innvik, Norway
  • Registered: 2015-08-25
  • Posts: 44
  • User Karma: 1

Re: Manchu thumb ring problems

Cheers, Pedrito! Yeah, why didn't I think of reaching out directly to Dekker myself?

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10 Reply by neil.han (edited by neil.han 2020-03-30 22:35:53)

  • Registered: 2020-03-28
  • Posts: 1

Re: Manchu thumb ring problems

Peter,

This is a late reply, hope it can help you and whoever is trying to find out more about the Manchu thumb ring.

The Manchu thumb ring release is like a trigger.

When the string being held by the ring, the ring/thumb is pointing horizontally and to your right.
When talking about "rotating your wrist", it is assuming your hand, then thumb also rotate in the same structure, maintain the same structure. So that the ring will not be at the squire position with the string anymore. The string can't be hold by the ring when the ring is tilted upward. The string will start to sliding off the ring.

Also since the ring will be hold by your thumb pointing somewhat upward, which will not be on the same direction of the string movement. That will keep the ring from sliding off your thumb.

If you look at that image I uploaded, the top tow drawing shows holding and after the rotating viewed from the back-right. When the string slides off the ring, your thumb is pointing upward. That holds the ring. (upward - just enough for the string to slide off)

http://www.koreanarchery.org/punbb/misc.php?action=pun_attachment&item=218&download=0&secure_str=1963t627
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/QLotX1mu_I6JOJ2lWx4H-nq_p4RzuA1y6JLpTUrUEVQ4qpCgnjMNxZ6zqPdLeH2M7a8oTC8210UABUQciTiIZWGBYhohSerCxuZm1asSf9U69XqGhr2ihisBRQy4YKFeJ3hsGFOGzVm0Z56Kcs8GQYZBatwit_kV9IVPefv8LnZvK-f1-AXzsrMvLFoy2Xah_d5RNB7RHyUrvH1y8c3aHb4GzoM29LJSlNAkEAlGlRVPkL5O4fYrxy0DivQDDPXi6E3vhGftFGrIdnenG73MbTL6ctkzf32-OWQGNVzgulZ4MCWwYXbXK2VqOQ2cemVu4IYRvcjYNhXowsUtu75kSxwGo9mSfU3NxgbyeCxz__LjjOemoskEKzaxCLf7PcNZGudk-eJrtgydhVJfgOz6UptqedgyRIlglGTfslB99coaGk-2iQo5O4u2g_VGNW8Rkt4aJgW3XH6KcPG5OZds7BzUbIBRPholvBDDAAnu9d-vuvrWOCk8iV7on3IiCyTWbEw75lX8IcPXNzCMFa3WV3nDw-36L4SsU9Jc_s8LYD2CguQPV6f9qyE5A6Swtj5JfTPWotBXNvKtB-cGVobo1TrwkdEPVG77c5vvb70sOUnTFprfFdX4rMrUOyZDRAeGc8-YvzpsP_AaOcVcllM-nAM00Nh2zh644rMMscJNONs09KBBfJg4bkp6yZHxg2w=w973-h1297-no

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